From:
"James Shupe (Formerly Jamie Shupe)"

Sent:
8/31/2019 4:58:19 AM

To:
"William Malone" <malone.will@gmail.com>

Cc:

Bcc:

Subject: Re: Detransitioner Amici brief for SCOTUS
Sorry, I forgot the Federalist link to Wong.
https://thefederalist.com/2019/04/01/doctor-advises-threatening-suicide-get-transgender-treatments-kids/

On Saturday, August 31, 2019, 12:17:48 AM EDT, William Malone <malone.will@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks James, this makes a ton of sense. This narrative explains all the pieces of the puzzle.
On Aug 30, 2019, at 6:47 PM, James Shupe (Formerly Jamie Shupe) <jamie.shupe@yahoo.com> wrote:

So another thing that points to the falsehood that they'll kill themselves without surgery is the historic long wait times in other countries.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11702389
Why isn't that happening?
My opinion is if they don't have severe mental illness that's co-morbid, the risk of suicide is negligible.
The late age that many get surgery supports that:
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7159732/oldest-person-in-britain-to-have-reassignment-surgery-shares-her-joy-at-becoming-a-woman-aged-81-thanks-to-the-nhs/
Now let's visit some of Spack's history.
Hasn't Spack basically taught them that cutting on themselves proves their transgender status with statements like this?
"In some cases, 9- or 10-year-old kids have staged suicide attempts."
"Stopping puberty is, in itself, a diagnostic test. If a girl starts to experience breast budding and feels like cutting herself, then she's probably transgendered."
http://archive.boston.com/bostonglobe/ideas/articles/2008/03/30/qa_with_norman_spack/?page=2
So stopping puberty is a diagnostic test? H'mm, where have I heard something similar before about hormones?

This is the quack I took online advice from:
"We can't do a genetic test, but we can administer cross-sex hormones and see if the individual responds positively or negatively to them. That procedure is routinely done after
the individual has had an extensive period of psychotherapy and is fully aware of the consequences. A negative reaction would result in extreme anxiety and discomfort. A
positive reaction is one where the individual reports a calming affect. Often described as a feeling of well-being."
http://www.avitale.com/FAQ.htm
Dr. Wong:

"Wong also had some startling advice for a parent seeking to get a child referred to his program. Although the questioner had not indicated any particular
urgency, Wong explained that parents should exaggerate the severity of their child’s condition to their local health offices."
"Wong said a suicide threat was an effective means of accomplishing this goal."
“So what you need is, you know what? Pull a stunt. Suicide, every time, [then] they will give you what you need,” Wong said, adding that gender-dysphoric
kids “learn that. They learn it very fast.”

On Friday, August 30, 2019, 08:13:12 PM EDT, William Malone <malone.will@gmail.com> wrote:
James, this is much appreciated, and already helpful. I’ve been trying to determine how to approach the whole topic, and I think you’ve honed right onto it: the dysphoria and suicidality are symptoms of an
underlying issue. The underlying issue needs to be treated. As I work through your references I’ll likely reach out again. My regards, Will
> On Aug 30, 2019, at 2:39 PM, James Shupe (Formerly Jamie Shupe) <jamie.shupe@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> Will,
>
> It aggravates me to no end that Wordpress deleted my Transgender Archive because I think it would have been helpful for your project to be able to browse the details of the many suicides articles I had
collected. What I came to see was a pattern of these kids being plagued by severe mental illness but yet their deaths get used for activism. A lot of the kids committed suicide even if they were well supported
and not bullied.
>
> I managed to gather a few of the links to give you a window into this. I still have the XML file for the site that could be uploaded into a new private Wordpress blog if necessary.
>
> To start, you said: "In particular, I want to fight back against the falsehood that it a child isn’t treated with hormones and surgery, they’ll kill themselves."
>
> Something that has to be addressed is they commit suicide even if they get the treatments and were totally supported because they're typically severely mentally ill. So giving these kids what they want and
what they think will help them doesn't mean they still won't kill themselves after they find out it didn't help them anyway.
>
> Sam Harel Price:
>
> (Pretty unrealistic to make this huge kid think they're going to become a female)
>
> https://villagegreennj.com/towns/suicide-popular-chs-grad-sam-price-sparks-transgender-youth-foundation/

>
> Carl Worth:
>
> "In the December 8 speech, Carl told classmates: 'Firstly, I'm dealing with depression. I want to be completely honest here and say that is has led to self harm in the past and has escalated to suicidal
thoughts and actions."
>
> https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4196578/Transgender-senior-18-kills-coming-out.html
>
> Skylar Lee:
>
> "In the spring I was hospitalized because of the toxic environment and relationships I was experiencing, at home and at school, with my family and my peers. During this time, the inner turmoil of confusion
over my identity only escalated. I went through several identities, sometimes changing every two weeks, from pansexual to lesbian, genderqueer, bigender, and genderfluid. Finally, in the summer before 10th
grade, I discovered I was transgender."
>
> http://ourlivesmadison.com/article/motivated-empowered/
>
> Miriam Roe:
>
> "Miriam was born female and began to identify as male in 11th grade in high school. At that time, they asked to be called Eli and began the transition process to male. Eli was very supported in this by their
family, friends, and at the State College High School. This past fall, Miriam began to understand their gender identity as more gender fluid than transgender and had recently begun asking people to call them
Miriam again."
>
> "Even as they suffered “bouts of crippling depression,” according to the obituary,"
>
> https://www.advocate.com/transgender/2016/3/08/family-and-friends-mourn-penn-state-trans-woman-lost-suicide
>
> Charlie, Charles Knowles and Charlie Maze:
>
> "Maisie Knowles, age 16, aka Charlie, Charles Knowles and Charlie Maze, made the decision to give up the struggle of living this life. We are deeply saddened that his struggle with mental illness got the
better of him. Faced with bipolar disorder, schizophrenia, borderline personality disorder, gender identity and just being a teenager, Charles had an incredibly difficult "hand to play."
>
> https://obituaries.centralmaine.com/obituaries/mainetoday-centralmaine/obituary.aspx?n=maisie-knowles-charlie&pid=182417101&fhid=11597
>
> "It's the fourth such suicide in San Diego County since March."
>
> https://web.archive.org/web/20151014211644/https://www.10news.com/news/family-mourns-transgender-teen-after-he-takes-his-own-life-100615
>
> Another thing possibly worth exploring is what I talked about in a follow-up piece with the Daily Signal.
>
> "Trinko: Yeah. Could you actually expand on that a little bit? Because often the thing that we hear is that if you don’t allow people to transition, they will commit suicide. But it sounds like you’re arguing that
the transition itself can make you suicidal."
>
> "Shupe: Yes, it does. Because that’s an interesting question. Let’s do the chicken and the egg thing. Does the gender dysphoria really come before? Or does it come [when] you’ve convinced somebody that
you’re the opposite sex? My argument is that it comes afterward. That’s exactly what happened in my case."
>
> "I’ll give you an example. Once I diagnosed myself as being a female, and people affirmed me as a female, OK, so I’m looking at myself and I’m going, “Oh my God, I’m in a male body.” And you set out on
this crash course to turn yourself into a female. And it’s impossible."
>
> "In the military we call that setting yourself up for failure. Like I said, it’s literally impossible to change your sex and you’ll die trying."
>
> https://www.dailysignal.com/2019/03/15/i-perfectly-understand-why-this-kills-people-former-transgender-jamie-shupe-details-how-process-affected-him/
>
> That's my thoughts for you for now, if I think of more stuff I'll forward the links.
>
> Blessings,
>
> James
>
>
>
>
> On Friday, August 30, 2019, 01:35:05 PM EDT, William Malone <malone.will@gmail.com> wrote:

>
>
>
>
>
> Dear James and Walt,
>
> I am beginning to put together a document summarizing the literature regarding the psychological outcomes/ suicide stats after transition. In particular, I want to fight back against the falsehood that it a child
isn’t treated with hormones and surgery, they’ll kill themselves. This argument overwhelms everything else, and I believe causes parents to agree to treatments that they otherwise would not agree to. I would
be most appreciative of any written materials you have on this topic. I’ve got the major long term studies showing no benefits, and stuff from Transgender trend and 4th wave now.
>
> Thanks both.
> Regards,
> Will
>
>
>
> William J. Malone, MD
> Endocrinologist
>
>
>> On Aug 30, 2019, at 9:43 AM, VBroyles <vbroyles@childparentrights.org> wrote:
>>
>>
> Very proud of you Jamie — and Walt!
>
>
> Vernadette
>
> Vernadette Broyles, Esq.
> President and General Counsel
> Child & Parental Rights Campaign, Inc.
> 5805 State Bridge Rd, Suite G310
> Johns Creek GA 30097
> Phone: 770-448-4525
> vbroyles@childparentrights.org
>
> <PastedGraphic-5.png>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>> On Aug 24, 2019, at 12:42 PM, James Shupe (Formerly Jamie Shupe) <jamie.shupe@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>

>>
>> All,
>>
>> With some gracious assistance, Walt Heyer, myself and some of the other detransitioners were also able to submit an amicus.
>>
>> https://www.supremecourt.gov/DocketPDF/18/18-107/113528/20190824011904782_18-107%20Amicus%20Brief%20of%20Walt%20Heyer%20et%20al..pdf
>>
>> Praying for our joint success in these endeavors for change.
>>
>> James
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Friday, August 23, 2019, 01:02:55 PM EDT, Andre Van Mol <95andrev@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Hola, Team SD.
>>
>> I worked with Michelle Cretella and a law professor at request of Alliance Defending Freedom to get out this amici for the SCOTUS Harris Funeral Home case. We directly took on the AMA and friends
amici, which was not that hard to disprove, IMHO. It’s the best I think we’ve ever done, though admittedly the others were Circuit Court cases and not SCOTUS. The law professor requests that his name be
kept out of communications involving this, as he is job hunting right now. I and Michelle are the primary researchers and therefor authors anyway, and conveniently our names do not appear on it (such is how
group projects often go and so be it). Don’t fear the page count, citations run up through page 18.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Also, my CMDA blog from yesterday seems to be on fire already, reprint approval requested by Christian Post, several bloggers already posted, other cool stuff, etc.
>> https://cmda.org/reinforcing-childrens-sexual-identity-a-review-of-ellie-klipps-i-dont-have-to-choose/
>>
>> Andre
>>
>>
>
>