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Natasha Chart
1/27/2020 6:53:35 AM
"jamie.shupe@yahoo.com" <jamie.shupe@yahoo.com>
"Andre Van Mol" <95andrev@gmail.com>, "Bernard Hudson, MD" <loyolamd82@gmail.com>, "Brooks Roger"
<rbrooks@adflegal.org>, "Chris Motz" <cmotz@sdcatholicconference.org>, "Cretella Michelle" <drmcretella@gmail.com>,
"David Pickup" <davidpickuplmft@gmail.com>, "Eunie Smith" <alaeagle@charter.net>, "Fred Deutsch"
<Fred.Deutsch@sdlegislature.gov>, "Glenn Ridder" <glenn.ridder@outlook.com>, "Heyer Walt" <waltsbook@yahoo.com>,
"Horvath Hacsi" <birdcatcher9@yahoo.com>, "Jon Hansen" <jon.hansen@sdlegislature.gov>, "Katherine Cave"
<kelseycoalition@gmail.com>, "MD Paul Hruz PhD" <hruz_p007@att.net>, "Margaret Clarke" <margaretclarke317@icloud.com>,
"Mary McAlister" <mmcalister@childparentrights.org>, "Mast Richard" <rmast@lc.org>, "McCaleb Gary" <mccgsm@gmail.com>,
"McHugh Paul" <pmchugh1@jhmi.edu>, "Monique Robles MD" <pamosa27@comcast.net>, "QUENTIN VAN METER"
<kidendo@comcast.net>, "Robbins Jane" <rlrobb123@gmail.com>, "Shafer Jeff" <jshafer@adflegal.org>, "Sharp Matt"
<msharp@adflegal.org>, "Timothy Millea MD" <tmillea@qcora.com>, "Vernadette Broyles" <vbroyles@childparentrights.org>,
"William Malone" <malone.will@gmail.com>, "mike@drlaidlaw.com" <mike@drlaidlaw.com>, "patrick Lappert"
<patrick@lappertplasticsurgery.com>

Subject: Re: Objections to bill- other thoughtss

The bill names no such class of person. It doesn’t even name gender dysphoria directly, or any other diagnosed
condition, as regards the procedures to be banned.
Gender identity laws aren’t based on a medical condition, either, though. No specific medical condition must be
claimed to qualify for the ACLU to defend your right to force everyone to agree that you’re something you aren’t,
nor must a specific diagnosis be made for a doctor to be considered as having a mandate to affirm a claim to be in
the ‘wrong body.’
The gender activists talk about a medical condition, but exclusively as a club with which to beat opponents. It
doesn’t underlay the reasoning or requirements of any of their key policy goals or proposals.
On Mon, Jan 27, 2020 at 9:39 AM James Shupe (Formerly Jamie Shupe) <jamie.shupe@yahoo.com> wrote:
Mike,
The interesting thing about number 7 is the ACLU will claim the bill is targeting a "class of people," and that
it's singling them out for discrimination. That's what they did for the gender dysphoria ban with trans military
service.
Hopefully, the lawyers will chime in on this, but my view is the bill is targeting a medical condition, of which
there's no fixed consensus about what the origin is, whether it's strictly mental, etc. The ADA law states
transvestism is excluded, so that allowed singling out a class of folks because a medical condition.
James

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

On Mon, Jan 27, 2020 at 9:21 AM, Michael Laidlaw

<mike@drlaidlaw.com> wrote:
Here are my thoughts on those items, Fred:
1. Suicide rates go up
Kids who are suicidal need competent mental health care, not sterilization.
The largest study tracking transgender people encompassed the entire population of Sweden over a 30 year period
and showed that hormones and sex reassignment surgery still left people at a 19X higher risk of completed suicide
compared to then general population.
The U.K.'s Tavistock GIDS clinic showed that children on blockers reported GREATER self-harm. Girls reported MORE
behavioral and emotional problems, greater dissatisfaction with body.
The latest survey study being touted by the mainstream media [by J Turban] actually shows that puberty blocker
use did NOT reduce the risk of inpatient hospitalization for suicide attempts.
2. Impact economy
[I'll leave this to the econ people]
3. Interferes with doctor-patient relationship
Not everything is permissible within a doctor-patient relationship. The doctor does not have a right to harm a
patient. A proper doctor-patient relationship involves full disclosure of the risks and benefits of a therapy. If
the child cannot fully understand the harms of therapy such as sterilization and removal of healthy body parts,
then the child is a part of an unhealthy doctor-patient relationship and the state MUST intervene to prevent
harms.
4. Interferes with parental rights
The parent also does not have the right to participate in the harm of their child. The parent is relying on
medical evidence that has been rated as low, very low and no quality evidence in the 2017 Endocrine Society
guidelines. The Endocrine Society guidelines in their disclaimer on p. 3895 states clearly that these treatments
are NOT standards of care. The state must intervene to prevent parents from inadvertently participating in the
harm of their child because they have received incomplete information on a poorly researched subject.
5. Parents must give consent – therefore it should be the parent held responsible, not the doctor
The parent provides consent based on a good faith assumption that the doctors are providing the best care
possible and have properly weighed the risks and benefits of treatment. However, the harms that come to a child
(e.g. sterilization, permanent disfiguration, heart disease risk, osteoporosis risk, etc.) are the primary result
of physicians who have performed the surgeries or given these medications. Only the doctor can truly comprehend
the potential scope of injury, and only they are licensed by the state to prescribe and perform these procedures.
It is not the job of the parent to investigate any and all potential harms of a medication or procedure. It is
the duty of a licensed physician. Therefore the culpability for harms to a patient, falls on the doctor.
[Perhaps, similar to a medical malpractice suit].

6. PB are reversible
The effects of Puberty Blockers are NOT reversible. The important time lost for normal development can never be
regained.
A key period of bone strengthening is affected putting the child at risk for adult osteoporosis.
A key period of brain development is affected, and many of the risks are unknown because they have not been
studied.
The U.K.'s Tavistock GIDS clinic showed that children on blockers reported GREATER self-harm. Girls reported MORE
behavioral and emotional problems, greater dissatisfaction with body.
Also a key time of growing together and interacting with peers and reaching important psychosocial milestones is
lost forever.
An analogy: Just imagine you've taken your child out of 6th grade for the entire year. Is the time lost
reversible? If you put them back in sixth grade, are they not in class with a bunch of students who are
developmentally younger than they? Can the time lost studying ever be regained? Will the child not be at a
disadvantage trying to catch up to the next grade? Can the important sixth grade experiences with peers ever be
the same?
7. Bill is unconstitutional
[Will leave to attorneys and legislators]
-Mike

On 2020-01-27 03:55, patrick Lappert wrote:
I think one has to be prepared to dismantle the validity of the WPATH guidelines:
-Where WPATH came from
-How the guidelines were crafted
-How they are ignored, even by adherents.
PWL
On January 26, 2020 at 11:28 PM Andre Van Mol <95andrev@gmail.com> wrote:
Those are the stats I've seen as well. So take away the medical students and residents, and the AMA really
isn't the A-MA.
As for it and the others, they are all professional guilds and susceptible to political/ideological/financial
manipulation. They are not scientific organizations, and people don't seem to get that.
Andre
On Jan 26, 2020, at 6:50 PM, Bernard Hudson < loyolamd82@gmail.com> wrote:
AMA membership hovers less than 20% of licensed physicians, actually about 17% of physicians and medical
students.
Decades ago, 3/4 of licensed doctors were members. The AMA movement towards accepting doctors killing
patients, and infants are patients, has destroyed the membership over the decades.

The issue will be that a physician is not a consensus doctor if not abiding by AMA affirmation guidelines.
In Tampa, August 2019, the opposing attorneys wrote: "Dr. Hudson is not a consensus physician and clearly
harms children."
Although they lost the case, gutting all of Florida's affirmation guidelines, they included 13 medical and
psychological organizations including, My God Yes!, the American High School Counselors Association!
Accept this approach as typical.
BH
On Jan 26, 2020, at 6:44 PM, James Shupe (Formerly Jamie Shupe) < jamie.shupe@yahoo.com> wrote:
That you're going against the advice of the American Medical Association and WPATH, etc.
Note: This email chain had Kara Dansky and Greg Scott, please remove them if you respond.
James

On Sunday, January 26, 2020, 07:39:39 PM EST, Fred Deutsch < fred.deutsch@sdlegislature.gov> wrote:

Brainstorming idea for objections to bill. Others that you think I should prepare for in addition claims that:

Suicide rates go up
Impact economy
Interferes with doctor-patient relationship
Interferes with parental rights
Parents must give consent – therefore it should be the parent held responsible, not the doctor
PB are reversable
Bill is unconstitutional

Patrick W. Lappert, MD
8263 Madison Blvd.
Suite E
Madison, AL 35758

.I