From:

Sent:

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Cc:

"James Shupe (Formerly Jamie Shupe)"
1/26/2020 6:23:15 AM
"QUENTIN VAN METER" <kidendo@comcast.net>, "mike@drlaidlaw.com" <mike@drlaidlaw.com>, "Fred Deutsch"
<Fred.Deutsch@sdlegislature.gov>
"Natasha Chart" <natasha.chart@gmail.com>, "Vernadette Broyles" <vbroyles@childparentrights.org>, "Mary McAlister"
<mmcalister@childparentrights.org>, "Michelle Cretella" <drmcretella@gmail.com>, "Katherine Cave"
<kelseycoalition@gmail.com>, "David Pickup" <davidpickuplmft@gmail.com>, "Eunie Smith" <alaeagle@charter.net>, "Gary
McCaleb" <mccgsm@gmail.com>, "Glenn Ridder" <glenn.ridder@outlook.com>, "Horvath Hacsi" <birdcatcher9@yahoo.com>,
"Hudson, MD Bernard" <loyolamd82@gmail.com>, "Jane Robbins" <rlrobb123@gmail.com>, "Patrick Lappert"
<patrick@lappertplasticsurgery.com>, "MD Paul Hruz PhD" <hruz_p007@att.net>, "Margaret Clarke"
<margaretclarke317@icloud.com>, "Matt Sharp" <msharp@adflegal.org>, "McHugh Paul" <pmchugh1@jhmi.edu>, "Monique Robles
MD" <pamosa27@comcast.net>, "Richard Mast" <RMast@lc.org>, "Roger Brooks" <rbrooks@adflegal.org>, "Scott, Greg"
<Greg.Scott@heritage.org>, "Timothy Millea MD" <TMillea@qcora.com>, "Walt Heyer" <waltsbook@yahoo.com>, "William
Malone" <malone.will@gmail.com>, "Jeff Shafer" <jshafer@adflegal.org>, "Chris Motz" <cmotz@sdcatholicconference.org>,
"Jon Hansen" <jon.hansen@sdlegislature.gov>, "Andre Van Mol" <95andrev@gmail.com>, "Kara Dansky" <kara11@me.com>


Bcc:

Subject: Re: Opposition strategy outlined in article. Have suggestion

Quentin,
I see that comparison as apples and oranges because in this instance the opposition are using the surgeries, to
borrow their language, as "gender confirmation."
It's important to note the evolution of the surgical language. It went from sex change surgery, to sex reassignment
surgery, to now gender confirmation surgery. All of this occurred because they were confronted with the fact that
white you can't change sex, you can change gender. Which has now created the problem of female meaning feminine and
male meaning masculine, which is driving the whole mess.
Then, of course, what does it say about those who refuse to surgically "confirm" their gender?
Answer: They are not a "true" transsexual. As if their really is such a thing. There's just varying degrees of
mental illness and comorbid sexual paraphilias.
James

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

On Sun, Jan 26, 2020 at 9:07 AM, QUENTIN VAN METER
<kidendo@comcast.net> wrote:

Just to play devil's advocate, how can we justify male circumcision when the medical benefits of such are equivocal? Obviously, there is a GIANT difference in the outcome of removing
entire organs as opposed to just a bit of foreskin. I am thinking out loud about what the opposition might say in rebuttal.
Quentin

On January 26, 2020 at 12:56 AM Michael Laidlaw <mike@drlaidlaw.com> wrote:
The following is along the lines of what Kara, Natasha, and Michelle have been saying. In fact Michelle and
I and others once had a conversation about Olson-Kennedy’s teen mastectomy study. We concluded that it is
not a scientific study at all, but a document filled with details of crimes by doctors against girls and
young women.
Here is my version rebutting the argument that this bill will cause an interference in the patientphysician relationship:
Doctors who willfully harm patients are criminals. If a doctor drugs a patient unconscious and surgically
removes her 14 year old, healthy breasts, this is a criminal act. The 14 year old cannot freely give
consent to this procedure as she does not have the capacity to know what her self at age 25 or 30 years old
would want. She can never have functional breasts replaced. Women who thought they were trans have
regretted this happened to them. One such woman uses donor milk because she is physically incapable of
producing milk after her mastectomy.
Likewise an 11 or 12 year old cannot make an informed consent decision to stop normal puberty. Puberty
blockers lead in the majority of cases to sterilization and sexual dysfunction. A boy or a girl of that age
cannot possibly know or understand if their future self at age 25 or 30 would want a child and functional
sexual relationships. They are not developmentally able to make such a decision.
The physician who blocks normal puberty and places the child on a pathway to sterility - which is what
happens in the majority of cases - is a criminal.
The cases described here do not constitute healthy physician-patient relationships. Indeed these are not
physician-patient relationships at all, they are criminal-victim relationships. The physician who does
mastectomies of 14 year old breasts or provides 11 years old puberty blockers has willfully caused harm to
a child - notwithstanding the desires or knowledge of the parents or child! The child is simply not able to
consent to the harms that will result. Just as a girl could not possibly provide consent to female genital
mutilation in another context. No matter if the parents and doctors all sign forms in agreement.
The physician is ultimately responsible for the harms as he or she is the only one who can sign the
prescriptions and use the scalpels and surgical tools in the operating room. The physician is criminal in
these scenarios and must be prosecuted by the law.
A just society cannot allow children - who by nature do not have the cognitive and developmental capacity
to comprehend the damage to their bodies and reproductive capabilities - to undergo these harmful
procedures.
-Mike
On 2020-01-25 10:05, QUENTIN VAN METER wrote:
Short, sweet and top notch.

Quentin

On January 24, 2020 at 8:08 PM Michael Laidlaw <mike@drlaidlaw.com> wrote:
All,
I've recorded my SD testimony and put it up on YouTube. Please share:
https://youtu.be/jBIDOSTgRTc
-Mike
On 2020-01-21 11:19, Natasha Chart wrote:
Exactly.
And even in the case of something like cancer, any sterilization is a side effect,
rather than a goal, of a treatment for other purposes. There's no directive that
children with cancer must be sterilized, and if doctors could prevent that outcome,
surely they would. For no other type of child is that considered a humane end goal of
treatment.
On Tue, Jan 21, 2020, 1:46 PM Vernadette Broyles < vbroyles@childparentrights.org>
wrote:
Barring an actual physical disease state for which such interventions offer a
cure. Puberty and a child's biological sex are not a disease. They are part
of normal human development and human functioning to be protected in a
developing minor.
Vernadette
Vernadette R. Broyles, Esq.
President and General Counsel

5805 State Bridge Rd., Suite G310
Johns Creek, GA 30097
770.448.4525
vbroyles@childparentrights.org
www.childparentrights.org

On Jan 21, 2020, at 1:38 PM, Natasha Chart < natasha.chart@gmail.com>

wrote:
Kara will be joining us to testify, and I bet that she would be willing
to join a statement saying that there's no definable class of person
who needs to be sterilized as children.
On Tue, Jan 21, 2020, 12:57 PM Vernadette Broyles <
vbroyles@childparentrights.org> wrote:
Fred and all,
CPR-C can prepare a rebuttal this week to the ACLU that Mary
(UCAL Berkely), Jane Robbins (Harvard Law), and I (Harvard Law,
Guardian ad Litem for children) can sign and send. I can ask
Kara Dansky (former ACLU lawyer) of Womens Liberation Front if
she'd be willing to sign from the left. Mary's email re:
involuntary sterilization would be key part of the response.
We also need to stress the point the the ACLU is entirely
missing the point of this bill — it nothing to do with
discriminating against any class of children, but rather
everything to do with protecting a vulnerable group of
children, and all children (given the social contagion). While
there may be a constitutional right to refuse to carry a child
to term (under Roe), there is no constitutional right to
chemically and surgically mutiliating one's healthy body, where
there is no disease to be treated — that is child abuse.
When would you need this?
Vernadette
Vernadette R. Broyles, Esq.
President and General Counsel

5805 State Bridge Rd., Suite G310
Johns Creek, GA 30097
770.448.4525
vbroyles@childparentrights.org
www.childparentrights.org

On Jan 16, 2020, at 11:42 AM, Michael Laidlaw <
mike@drlaidlaw.com> wrote:
Very well stated Mary.

Very well stated Mary.
On a different note, I have this new thread dispelling the "wrong puberty" argument.
https://twitter.com/MLaidlawMD/status/1217698028858986497
-Mike

On 2020-01-16 07:08, Mary McAlister wrote:
Yes, and also point out that these procedures amount to involuntary sterilization
of minors. They cannot legally or psychologically consent. Their parents cannot
give informed consent since the knowledge necessary for informed consent does
not exist. The Supreme Court struck down laws providing for sterilization of serial
criminals in Skinner v. Oklahoma and mentally incompetent adults cannot be
sterilized even if their guardians consent without a court order. Are the ACLU
and similar groups advocating for involuntary sterilization of children? Also their
equal protection arguments are without merit. " Transchildren" are not being
treated differently from other children. In fact the opposite is true. This bill will
ensure that "transchildren" have the same protections from dangerous medical
experiments as do other children.
On Thu, Jan 16, 2020, 8:55 AM Natasha Chart < natasha.chart@gmail.com>
wrote:
Agreed.
On Thu, Jan 16, 2020 at 8:33 AM < drmcretella@gmail.com> wrote:
Let's Memorize Katherine's response and repeat it ad
nauseam regardless the question or accusation. That is
the bottom line here. We must be bull dogs on this fact
and principle.
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 16, 2020, at 7:59 AM, Kelsey
Coalition < kelseycoalition@gmail.com>
wrote:
No doctor or parent has a right to subject a
child to a life-altering medical experiment
with unknown long-term consequences.
Without this ban in place, SD will follow what
is already happening in other states: minors
who successfully sue in court to obtain this
supposedly "life-saving" medical intervention.
And when they grow up with irreversible
regret, who will be liable? The state.
This ban is also important to prevent custody
battles. We have several parents who have
reached out to the KC because of a former
spouse who is intent on medicalizing their
child. Finding an attorney to help is nearly as
difficult as finding a therapist. And even
when they do, who knows how a judge will
rule? Banning these procedures will take
these serious medical decisions away from
misinformed judges.

The claim that this is lifesaving medically
necessary intervention is the big
unchallenged domino that is driving both the
legal and medical scandal. This is an oftrepeated claim with no support and it must
be confronted directly.

On Wed, Jan 15, 2020 at 6:47 PM Natasha
Chart < natasha.chart@gmail.com> wrote:
The ACLU have done as much as
anyone could to make sure it's
impossible to define a class of
persons under these laws.
On Wed, Jan 15, 2020, 5:22 PM
< drmcretella@gmail.com> wrote:
Mike,
Look at the medical
claim in that "legal"
ACLU quote; it is
false on multiple
grounds
"no such thing as a
medically diagnosable
group of trans
anybody; we are
talking about minors!
blockers, wrong sex
hormones and
surgical mutilation
are never medically
necessary in minors!"
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan
15, 2020,
at 5:00
PM,
David
Pickup <
davidpick
uplmft@g
mail.com
> wrote:
Translati
on..."It's
ok to
harm
boys by
removing
body
parts
because
at least
we're

preservin
g a class
of
people."
This is
the
height of
political
correctn
ess.
David Pickup, LMFT-S

I

(888) 288-2071
15851 Dallas Parkway, Suite 600
Addison, TX 75001
www.davidpickuplmft.com

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